rare kits

[francis]

l was just wondering about rare kits
l have noticed a lot of guys are trying to get there hands on their own personal Grail kits but how many would build them
l know l would and also l know that there are a maybe a handful that would build them
whats the point of getting a kit that you you are not going to build
maybe l am wrong but there seems to be a lot of trading and selling but really not alot of building going on
in the past l have tried to cast up rare stuff and with the help of fellow model guys to promote builds but all the stuff l sell seems to get put away in closets or sold on ebay
god Know how many Richard Carroll tires l cast and can only think of two builds that l saw them on
and so many people wanted to see the Uncertain cast and haven't seen l built
maybe it's time to stop collecting and start building

[Starry Eyes]

Good point Joe ... I see this on several other groups as well ... speaking for myself, I have built more rare kits this year than ever before .. starting with a Horn Toad which was graced with a set of your RC tires ... then on to several original issued Baja Humbug Deal's Wheels kits, an original "Scuttle Bucket" then on to all the "Road Runner and Coyote " kits .. then a "Wackie Woodie" presently working on a Stroker McGurk "Ghost of America" .. Also I have a Va-Va Vette in the works ... I managed to pick up several of my grails but as usual a guy can only build so fast .lol... I guess at our (my ) age a guy wants to be surrounded with grails just knowing it's there if a guy wants to build it next ... There's a couple more on my list as well that will be built and setting on my shelf as soon as I get my grubby little mitts on them .. ;D
On the other hand I have traded a few rare one's off over the years myself to fellow klowns here on the C.C. 2 .. some have traded them , some have just collected them, I have seen noe of them built either... I figure if I let a kit go to someone , they can do as they please... a man would drive himself crazy keeping track of who built what or who traded what I sold ... I figure if I wanted it so bad I wouldn't have let it go .. Ha! Ha! .. now that's a funny one .. "never let it go" .. oh haw many kits I've owned and sold only to tell myslef "I should have never let it go" ...

[ShowRodFreak Don V.]

It's been three years for me. All work and no play. I have ten ideas in the works but life gets in the way sometimes. Weird thing is......... I visit the site from work not at home.......go figure.

All the Richard Carrol tires I bought were separated to each project in my agenda ;D to be continued.

[ramone]

One man's treasure is another man's junk!!
You have a very good point Joe.Most of us guys have so many kits that it would take more than a natural live to build them all.So I say lets start building like a madman,Rare ones first ;D
None of my kits are sealed,outside and inside,because when a kit arrives at my home I tear of the seal because I want to look inside.Sometimes I'm disappointed and sometimes exited!!!For me that's part of the fun.Secondly the parts get out of the bag and I start looking,test fitting and just fiddling around with them.
And then i will build it no matter of it's value.....I want to see how it turns out.
I don't have a whole lot of rare kits,only a hand full,but that's because I was born in the wrong country I guess ;D
It's always a pleasure to look at the work from Dave and Chuck for example because these and some other guys build models that you don't get to see every day!! Keep up the good work guys!!

[donculley]

I think its hard for some people to build a rare kit because once its opened or built, its one less mip kit in the world . Some people also just like to collect mint kits and not build any. Its the same thing with old Hotwheels. Some have to have them mip, other guys buy mip cars and then tear them open to put them in cases . As for me, I like my Hotwheels out of the packages, and if they have a little wear, thats ok too. I have a few cars still in the packages, but I can't bring myself to open them, even though I would rather have them that way !

[jim]

I agree and plead quilty on both counts when I first "rediscovered" modeling I went crazy with buying, and most of you saw what I ended up with, even after selling almost half of my "collection" I still have more plastic than I could eat in a lifetime, and a lot of them "grail" kits. But I also noticed and it rings true for me I there is a lot less time to build in the summer. Life does happen.
I wonder if this happens to you guys as well, I have a lot on the bench that I start and dont finish, 3 for the DW/Zinger contest that wont make it, an Uncertial resin that I got from one of you guys 75% done, 3 or 4 Pro street based kits, I get these great Ideas as least as I'm concerned and then they peter out after I start them.
Keep building and stay dry
Jim

[customcruiserroy]

I have no idea why I go and chase grails. Because like some, I buy it, whether build or not, play with them (okay look at them), and then sell most of them back out. I think I buy them on whims and then sell them out when the shine wears off. BuT I still have some that remind me of my pops so I will never let them go. Or I have one that was the first model I ever made. I found one a few years ago and that one will stay unbuilt almost just for the sake of memories.

When I find an old kit I want, I always look for two. One I think I will build and the other to have in storage for some odd reason. I will not open one unless I have two.

Then I have the issue of timing. I go and collect a certain type and then they reissue them! Arghhhh!! So, then the one I got is basically worthless. So, why sell it? It stays in my stash.

For instance, I bought a Deal's Wheels VW Van that was busted up and missing parts on evilBay for $22. Then what happened? They were reissued. I am happy to have mine and in fact I restored it somewhat. I made some of the missing parts from scratch and I got lucky and bought odd parts from fellow clowns. So, my thing is, I think, the fun of trying to rebuiild one that looks like junk to someone else. I have 2 Rommel Rods that way. I paid $70 each and now what? They reissue! LOL!! But I love the fact that I have two originals. Not worth selling but I'm still happy.

I have a basement of sealed kits that I look at and say I would love to tear the plastic but why? If I want to sell them later for more plastic money, I will end up getting less than I paid if opened. It happens.

Then, if I do sell one, I get seller's remorse almost immediately. So, I go out and find another one. LOL!!

I do try and build but can never get them out as fast as some of these clowns. And I can't figure out how they move them out so fast.

My kid is going to make a small fortune when I die. I hope she keeps them and builds some of them in honor of Daddy who spent a lot of time and money with "toys".

have a blessed day!

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[davea]

Thanks for the nice comment, Ramone. With the monster stash I have, I know that I can't build them all, but I'm doing my best! How much my grails are worth or how rare they are doesn't matter to me, I'm going to build as many as I can. I've tried to build some of those that we just don't get to see almost at all, like The One-Arm Bandit, The Horse Hide Hauler/Surf'N Van, The Rattler, The Dragray and others.

Thanks for bringing it up, Joe. We DO need to break out the good stuff and build! I bought a bunch of those Richard Carroll tires from you a long time back, used 'em in this last contest, and I've got another project going right now that I'll be using more of them on.

Jim, as to having a bunch of unfinished builds lying around; most everyone seems to do that, but I guess I'm the odd one here. I don't. I don't start another kit until I follow through and FINISH the one I'm working on. A few months ago I did break that when I did a connected 3 build project, 3 different Corvair funnys, I was working on all 3 at the same time. Now I'll start work on 2 or 3 at the same time, ONLY because I know I won't stop until they're done. I just don't have boxes of partially built kits or unfinished projects.

Since I've buying and building since the early '60s, I have just about all the grails anyone could want. When they reissue one of these grails, I celebrate! I build my grails, but I'll leave the MIB original, and build the repop. It's a blast to be able hit the LHS and see The Rommel's Rod, Dragon Wagon, Tijuana Taxi, Red Baron, Double Dragster, 3 in 1 '25 T, and others on the shelves!

[scotttansley]

I'm definitely a builder. Through my occupation as an animator in film and tv I must be disciplined and work to a schedule and budget. My hobby allows me to escape from that part of my job and just be my own boss and take as long as I want with no producer telling me how to do it. I built models in the 60's and early 70's. Fast forward 40 years and I wanted to build a rat fink. The guy in the shop here in Australia said that if you want any more of this kind of stuff, ebay is your only hope. I checked ebay and was amazed. I now have all the Roth characters, Fred Flypogger, Park's Born Losers, all of the Deal's wheels that I want to build and the odd rare wonder like Stroker Mcgurk etc.
This started about a year ago and I already have a good many of them built already. I look in my cabinets and see about 40 pieces that were not there a year ago. Some of these are figures and my own sculpts too. I build these to the best of my ability sparing absolutely no expense in time and money to make that happen.
I have been an over collector in the early 90's with my 43rd scale car collection and have learnt to stick to exactly what I will build. Over the last year I have been amassing this collection for building and have finished collecting and now only use ebay for model supplies and tools and aftermarket accessories to go towards these builds. I have to say though that the searching and acquiring over the past year of these rare beauties has been a blast and I can relate to the collector of MIB who don't plan to build. They are still preserving these that still may be built by them or some other lucky builder in 10 or 40 years time.
One of the biggest parts of my collection is that it represents the culture of an era. This is something that's dear to me and im sure you all can relate to. The 60's and early 70's were a great period in America and here in my country Australia. A time of no political correctness, a time where no matter what your occupation you could afford a home of your own. A time where poking fun at Hitler or mainstream culture would not make you a social outcast. Artist like Ed Roth, Dave Deal and Fred Flypogger created amazingly cool creations that just are not or would not be allowed these nanny state days. It was the last of the truly creative unrestricted freedom. I just dont get modern day art. It could just as easily have been done by 6 year olds and true artists now are often forced underground. Thank god for the internet. And god bless an era that was fun in every possible way, the likes of what we will never see again.
So power to those of you who just collect, power to those of you who build no matter how good they turn out. Power to those who just joined this forum to simply talk about this. And power to me, I get to combine 50 years of my past experience of engineering, model building, art, painting, sculpting, science, culture and great times in each and every one of my creations.

PS: Im still new here and hope that wasn't to much of a rant.

[flounder]

A few years back I managed to complete my grail collection. ( There may be a few out there still - Helloo where is that Young American?) If I had more time, I'd build them all. Retirement is still many years off. But they will be there when I am ready.

I did manage to complete a Flame Out. Does that get me off the hook?

I have some of those Carroll tires form Joe. Great reproductions. Someday I'll put together a tribute to Richard. Nothing has come to mind so far, but I would like it to be very unique.

Oh, and Joe and I still have our shelf-dust collecter trades finish. Hey Joe - How's that twin engine 34 P/U coming? I drew a picture of the Altered T. I also look at the parts from time time to time. It's a great hobby!!

Flounder

[robriley]

I used a set of your richard carrols joe.

[modelcitizen]

As others have said, "An excellent point Joe!"

I have a couple in the works as well and a grandiose plan for "something SPECTACULAR"!

I guess all I can say is, "It SUCKS to get old!" and "Life Happens!" BUT, I'm still kickin"! ;D ;D ;D





"Paulie"

[barten]

Joe . . . great question! I have a set too. . .. Joe. . and they are VERY cool. . . I have not used them. . . yet! But consider them on each project.

Yea summer is a hard time to build for me. .. but I did start building. . but not a show rod. . . so I didn't post any pictures.

Hey speaking of projects. . . how did your license plate project turn out when we all sent our old plates to you . .. I know I sent you a bunch! I bet it looks really cool. . . Did you ever post a picture? I might have missed it.

God Bless
Barten

[chromecop]

I buy all my kits with an intention to build them. That's what kits are for, right?

[rallygsc]

Hello Everyone:

really good question indeed.

I was trying my hardest for the longest time to get a Rommel's rod, Dragon Wagon or Tijuana taxi, those kits to me were ones I always wanted, but I did not want to pay the collector's premium to own them.

thankfully they were reissued and I acquired all three without breaking the bank.

there is a few other kits out there which I would consider grail kits for myself, but I build them.

my late friend James Hippie Bush once told me, if you have a hobby enjoy it, if you buy a model, build it, why buy it just for collectors value when there's no fun in that.

I agree.

I stopped building for a long while due to a lot of my buddies passing away and I needed to get out of that funk, so back to the shelves and start building again.

[Psychotic Hillbilly]

I cant afford to build to often as I dont get the items I pay for all the time. So I take a hit and have to get the stuff again some where else.


Ken...

[Brandon]

I am not a collector.. I have about five kits that are unbuilt and will stay that way that are ones from my youth, and frankly they aren't worth much at all, just cool kits I had that left an impression.

Now as far as other's "grail kits" lol.. I have kit-bashed my share and will continue to do so... though many of them were built from glue bombs. For me, everything is just parts to create something new. Out of all the built kits I have, maybe five are box stock.

Build them, create things, and enjoy them...

[hobbybobby]

A rare item is a rare item, be it a stamp, a coin, a model, a magazine, or a kit.


That is certainly true.

But again, being rare does not make an item have value.

That seems to be something that a number of people don't understand- or don't want to accept.


Coins and stamp have been collected worldwide for centuries/millennia.

Collecting them has been doen for long enough and by enough people that value has been assigned to collectible pieces.

This value may sometimes be obscure and/or arbitrary seeming, but it is widely recognized and accepted.

Whether or not a particular collector sees personal value to a particular item, the market for it is well enough established that it really can be said to be 'worth something'.

These items are not valuable because they are old or even rare- but because there is a well established and consistent market for them.



Model kits on the other hand are only sought after by people who want a particular model kit.

The market is fantastically small, fickle and obscure.

Therefore while some kits may often trade between certain individuals for elevated amounts, it does not mean that these kits are worth these amounts.

Just because someone was willing to pay that amount does not mean that everyone (or anyone else) would pay that amount.

If you are a good salesman, you might be able to sell a collection of older kits, and be able to turn a profit on most of them.

But that does not mean that the kits you are selling have any value- it means that you have skill (or luck).


You could apply your luck equally well to selling used cars or real estate- or elephant sh!t.


Buying ANYTHING early on, keeping it unused for years, and selling it later, could make you a profit, if you leave out inflation.

But, I think the only reason to collect anything is because you enjoy the subject.

If you sell the collection later, and make a profit, great, but that shouldn't be the main driver.


Kits are meant to be built and not to make bucket loadss of money.


I never buy a kit that I dont build.

Sure I have a stash, but I always buy with the intention to build, although I must admit that I've also got to find the key to eternal life if I'm going to build all of them... ;D


And, hey, at the end of the day, its yours to do with what you will...


Take care

[stilljustharley]

Collecting stuff always seems to fall into one of two categories for me: when you collect stamps, coins etc there is a recognition that you can't really do anything with them - you buy them, you stick 'em in an album or whatever and you look at them from time to time (then maybe sell them again).

Kits, and indeed full size cars and bikes, are different because you can do something with them. Whether you will is down to you as, in the same way that launching your 100 point T' bolt down a track probably won't do its resale value any favours, cracking open a MIB L'il Gypsy Wagon will reduce its value if you ever do come to sell it.

I don't think I own a kit I wouldn't build, no matter how rare it might be. That said, I have sold on rare kits if I decide that they would be a POS to build.

Which brings me to my basis for a kit being worth big bucks, it's got to be rare (and by that I mean not only is the kit itself rare but you can't clone it from later issues - I'm a builder after all!), it's got to be a subject I like and the end result has got to look good - if I'm going to spend weeks getting it to look right I'd rather start with something nearer the mark.

Your money, your choice!

[Bert]

If I have a grail, my intention is to build it. I even like the Brandon style of bashing grails. ;D ;D I am trying to get back to the desk. I'll look through the kits and get a grail started. Now, I have to figure out what a grail kit is for me. Hmmmm! Maybe a Haulin Hearse, or a Firebomb w/firetruck stuff added. It will be a tough decision.

I'll make you proud Joe! I don't have any of the RC tires, I must have been in time out! ;D ;D I do have one of the excellent UncertainT's. It may end up as a stretched dragster or altered roadster. ;D ;D ;D

[francis]

thanks for the input guys
it's good to know the most of you guys will build the rare kit
as for me l figure rare kits are meant to be built
but l guess it's worth what someone wants to pay for it
just like like the rare cars/speed parts are meant to be used
it always makes me sad to something that was supposed to be built or raced/driven for that matter tucked away in a cosy garage
never to see the light of day until it time to show it off